End Times and Current Events
March 29, 2024, 01:30:22 am
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Welcome To End Times and Current Events.
 
  Home Help Search Gallery Staff List Login Register  

Jesus' name ruled 'unconstitutional'

Shoutbox
March 27, 2024, 12:55:24 pm Mark says: Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked  When Hamas spokesman Abu Ubaida began a speech marking the 100th day of the war in Gaza, one confounding yet eye-opening proclamation escaped the headlines. Listing the motives for the Palestinian militant group's Oct. 7 massacre in Israel, he accused Jews of "bringing red cows" to the Holy Land.
December 31, 2022, 10:08:58 am NilsFor1611 says: blessings
August 08, 2018, 02:38:10 am suzytr says: Hello, any good churches in the Sacto, CA area, also looking in Reno NV, thanks in advance and God Bless you Smiley
January 29, 2018, 01:21:57 am Christian40 says: It will be interesting to see what happens this year Israel being 70 years as a modern nation may 14 2018
October 17, 2017, 01:25:20 am Christian40 says: It is good to type Mark is here again!  Smiley
October 16, 2017, 03:28:18 am Christian40 says: anyone else thinking that time is accelerating now? it seems im doing days in shorter time now is time being affected in some way?
September 24, 2017, 10:45:16 pm Psalm 51:17 says: The specific rule pertaining to the national anthem is found on pages A62-63 of the league rulebook. It states: “The National Anthem must be played prior to every NFL game, and all players must be on the sideline for the National Anthem. “During the National Anthem, players on the field and bench area should stand at attention, face the flag, hold helmets in their left hand, and refrain from talking. The home team should ensure that the American flag is in good condition. It should be pointed out to players and coaches that we continue to be judged by the public in this area of respect for the flag and our country. Failure to be on the field by the start of the National Anthem may result in discipline, such as fines, suspensions, and/or the forfeiture of draft choice(s) for violations of the above, including first offenses.”
September 20, 2017, 04:32:32 am Christian40 says: "The most popular Hepatitis B vaccine is nothing short of a witch’s brew including aluminum, formaldehyde, yeast, amino acids, and soy. Aluminum is a known neurotoxin that destroys cellular metabolism and function. Hundreds of studies link to the ravaging effects of aluminum. The other proteins and formaldehyde serve to activate the immune system and open up the blood-brain barrier. This is NOT a good thing."
http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-08-11-new-fda-approved-hepatitis-b-vaccine-found-to-increase-heart-attack-risk-by-700.html
September 19, 2017, 03:59:21 am Christian40 says: bbc international did a video about there street preaching they are good witnesses
September 14, 2017, 08:06:04 am Psalm 51:17 says: bro Mark Hunter on YT has some good, edifying stuff too.
View Shout History
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Jesus' name ruled 'unconstitutional'  (Read 395 times)
akfools
Guest
« on: October 29, 2011, 08:53:11 pm »

Jesus' name ruled 'unconstitutional'
Judge says prayers to Christ 'do violence to America's pluralistic, inclusive values'



A board of county commissioners in North Carolina is asking the Supreme Court for help: Its members don't believe they should have to forbid volunteers from mentioning the name of Jesus in prayers offered before their meetings.

But the American Civil Liberties Union and Americans United for Separation of Church and State are standing by their victory in a U.S. circuit court decision that states even "a solitary reference to Jesus Christ" in invocations before the Forsyth County Board of Commissioners' meetings could do "violence to the pluralistic and inclusive values that are a defining feature of American public life."

Furthermore, wrote Judge James Harvie Wilkinson III in the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals majority opinion, legislative invocations offered in Jesus' name are inherently "sectarian" and thus should be censored lest they make some attendees feel "uncomfortable, unwelcome and unwilling to participate in … public affairs."

What is Christianity's role in the nation? Find out in "Christianity and the American Commonwealth"

But the board disagrees, and with the help of the Alliance Defense Fund is asking the Supreme Court to trump Wilkinson's ruling.

"America's founders opened public meetings with prayer; this county simply wants to allow its citizens to do the same," said ADF Senior Counsel David Cortman in a statement. "We trust the U.S. Supreme Court will want to review this case because of the long history in America of offering prayers before public meetings. Public officials shouldn't be coerced into censoring the prayers of those invited to offer them just because secularist groups don't like people praying according to their own conscience."

       

For years, the board has extended an open invitation to religious leaders from the community to volunteer a prayer before its twice-monthly meetings, asking only that the invocations "not be exploited as an effort to convert others … nor to disparage any faith or belief."

But a pair of local citizens, Janet Joyner and Constance Lynn Blackmon, attended the meetings regularly and were bothered by the frequent mentions of Jesus in the prayers. After the pair sat through yet another Christian prayer, this one including references to "the Cross of Calvary" and the "Virgin Birth," they sued the board of commissioners with help from the ACLU and Americans United lawyers.

After a pair of appeals, Judge Wilkinson handed down a majority opinion Americans United called "a major win for church-state separation."

"While legislative prayer has the capacity to solemnize the weighty task of governance … it also has the potential to generate sectarian strife," Wilkinson reasoned. "Such conflict rends communities and does violence to the pluralistic and inclusive values that are a defining feature of American public life."

"It is not enough to contend, as the dissent does, that the policy was 'neutral and proactively inclusive,'" the ruling continues. "Take-all-comers policies that do not discourage sectarian prayer will inevitably favor the majoritarian faith in the community at the expense of religious minorities living therein. This effect creates real burdens on citizens – particularly those who attend meetings only sporadically – for they will have to listen to someone professing religious beliefs that they do not themselves hold."

The Forsyth Board's invocations, the court determined, "made at least two citizens feel uncomfortable, unwelcome and unwilling to participate in the public affairs of Forsyth County. To be sure, citizens in a robust democracy should expect to hear all manner of things that they do not like. But the First Amendment teaches that religious faith stands on a different footing from other forms of speech and observance."

Judge Wilkinson concluded, "In order to survive constitutional scrutiny, invocations must consist of the type of nonsectarian prayers that solemnize the legislative task and seek to unite rather than divide."

But does a volunteer's prayer that merely mentions Jesus necessarily "divide"?

The court referenced one of its prior decisions in which it ruled a town council's prayers "clearly 'advance[d]' one faith, Christianity, in preference to others … because they ended with a solitary reference to Jesus Christ."

The ruling further projected, "As our nation becomes more diverse, so also will our faiths. To plant sectarian prayers at the heart of local government is a prescription for religious discord. … In their public pursuits, Americans respect the manifold beliefs of fellow citizens by abjuring sectarianism and embracing more inclusive themes."

Judge Paul Niemeyer, however, dissented from the two majority judges in the three-judge panel that heard the case, arguing that the court is, in application, "regulating" public prayer.

"When offering legislative prayers in which the Divine Being is publicly asked for guidance and a blessing of the legislators, religious leaders will hereafter have to refrain from referencing the Divine Being with the inspired or revealed name," Niemeyer wrote. "The majority has dared to step in and regulate the language of prayer – the sacred dialogue between humankind and God. Such a decision treats prayer agnostically; reduces it to civil nicety.

"Most frightfully," he continued, "it will require secular legislative and judicial bodies to evaluate and parse particular religious prayers."

Alliance Defense Fund Senior Counsel Brett Harvey agrees.

"The decision is troubling on many fronts," Harvey wrote in a blog post. "It is out of step with many other federal courts that have considered the validity of public invocations, including the United States Supreme Court. It ignores the religious heritage and history of our nation. But more troubling is the impact of the court's decision on prayer itself. ... It requires the government to censor private prayers and engage in comparative theology."

He concludes, "The Constitution prohibits the government from deciding which religious words are acceptable and which are not, even if the goal is to make people feel more comfortable."

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=361461
Report Spam   Logged

Share on Facebook Share on Twitter

Kilika
Guest
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2011, 04:53:20 am »

Wannabe Christians need to stop forcing their "churchianity" on secular society. Government is secular, period, and it doesn't like any religion. These people keep giving real Christianity a bad name with their public displays of worship where it's not welcome and outloud prayer in public for all to see and hear. These people know exactly what they are doing, and that's why the non-Christian crowd get so upset at this kind of stuff.

And then you have on the opposite side of this the ADL and that "Athiests R US" group Americans United for Seperation of Church and State, both of which are just as guilty as the churchianity crowd.

"they are of the world..."
Report Spam   Logged
Psalm 51:17
Global Moderator
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 28357


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2011, 09:25:20 am »

Wannabe Christians need to stop forcing their "churchianity" on secular society. Government is secular, period, and it doesn't like any religion. These people keep giving real Christianity a bad name with their public displays of worship where it's not welcome and outloud prayer in public for all to see and hear. These people know exactly what they are doing, and that's why the non-Christian crowd get so upset at this kind of stuff.

And then you have on the opposite side of this the ADL and that "Athiests R US" group Americans United for Seperation of Church and State, both of which are just as guilty as the churchianity crowd.

"they are of the world..."

In your opinion, do you think there may be some kind of Hegelian Dialect going on? Where you have the supposedly "Christian" crowd vs. the supposedly "anti-Christian" crowd going at each other for the whole world to see? Next thing we know, all it does is paint Christians in a bad light.

When I was unsaved, I remember watching all the news reports on tv when hot button issues would come up - for example, abortion, and then "influential" evangelical leaders would come up to the Supreme Court building with others to pray openly in front of everyone, with demonstrators on the opposite side(ie-"separation of church and state" groups) protesting their part, and the news media guys would just have a field day with this. As a result, the public perception would be looking down on Christians, and NOT on athiests and anti-Christians.

And then to throw this out there too - over the very long haul, you have "evangelicals" like Rick Warren and Joel Osteen coming out and acting like they embrace BOTH political parties and ideologies(ie-Warren invited both Obama and Rep Sen Brownback to his Saddleback service simultaneously), and then all of a sudden the evangelical and non-evangelical world is embracing both of these guys.
Report Spam   Logged
Kilika
Guest
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2011, 03:26:32 am »

I don't think it's that intentional, but the end results of a bad image is the same.
Report Spam   Logged
Overcast
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 75



View Profile
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2011, 10:43:05 am »

I suppose I'll be spending a lot of time in Jail as soon as Christianity is outlawed.
See you all there! lol

It won't matter I suppose, by that time, the world will be in such dire straits that it won't be around much longer anyway.
Report Spam   Logged

... knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”  (2 Peter 3)
Kilika
Guest
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2011, 03:11:35 pm »

"What shall we then say to these things? If God [be] for us, who [can be] against us?" Romans 8:31 (KJB)
Report Spam   Logged
Overcast
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 75



View Profile
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2011, 03:13:42 pm »

"What shall we then say to these things? If God [be] for us, who [can be] against us?" Romans 8:31 (KJB)

And like Paul - if we get tossed in the slammer for our belief - it will give opportunity to preach there too.

At one time, humanity "killed" Christ in an attempt to stop this 'heresy' - and like it was said in 'Star Wars' too - "killing" him only made him far more powerful than they could ever imagine.
Report Spam   Logged

... knowing this first: that scoffers will come in the last days, walking according to their own lusts, and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of creation.”  (2 Peter 3)
Kilika
Guest
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2011, 03:20:03 pm »

Indeed! and Amen!
Report Spam   Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by EzPortal
Bookmark this site! | Upgrade This Forum
Free SMF Hosting - Create your own Forum

Powered by SMF | SMF © 2016, Simple Machines
Privacy Policy